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News and Commentary On Newcastle United Football Club By Ed Harrison, A Proud Exiled Geordie And Lifelong Fan

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Newcastle Situation Similar To When Keegan Rejoined Newcastle

11:31 am, Thursday, November 29th, 2012 by Dr. Ed Harrison · 175 Comments

Newcastle’s right full-back Danny Simpson was like all out players after last night;’s game, and bitterly disappointed that we had leaked two goals in the last 9 minutes of the game at stoke, when we looked comfortable as though we were heading for our first victory in five league games in the Premier League.

Kevin Keegan – in his second spell as Newcastle manager
It took 9 league games before we got a win

But it was not to be, but there were many positives to take out of the game – Papiss Cisse finally got his first league goal of the season, and that will help his confidence no end, and all our players carried out the game plane almost to perfection, and yet we still came up short, and it was indeed another terrible result, but on the bright side – a very decent performance.

Danny Simpson talked of Newcastle almost getting a famous win last night

“It was a big blow. You can’t fault our performance and we gave it everything, every single one of us.” “We looked comfortable and we felt comfortable at the back. We were dealing with everything they threw at us and we were trying to get a second goal.”

“We had a couple of chances, but the first goal and then the second one straight afterwards were just a big blow because I think we deserved a win, to be honest with you.” “We all had a good chat after Southampton and said it wasn’t good enough and that we need to perform better away from home to give us a chance.”

“And it was the complete opposite from Southampton.” “We did everything right. The game-plan was perfect and we went 1-0 up. But those two goals were a killer because I thought we deserved to win the game.” “I don’t think they were better than us, but they got the two goals.”

“We have got a couple of days now before the next game and we have to pick ourselves up and get going again.”

Next up is Wigan at home on Monday night, and we hope there’s a good turnout from the fans – to roar Newcastle onto a possible first win in six league games.

It’s  a lot like we were in the 2007-2008 season when Kevin Keegan was in charge, and Newcastle kept coming up short, and didn’t win a first league game under Kevin until his 9th league game in charge.

And that was the 2-0 win at home to Fulham on 22nd March – and Kevin had rejoined Newcastle on 16th January, 2008 – following the sacking of big Sam Allardyce.

In those previous 8 league games we had three draws and five defeats – 3 points from 8 games.

But Kevin was right and he said once we got that first win, the confidence it will give the players will make the team OK – and in the last 7 league games of that season we got 11 points, with 3 wins and two draws and two defeats.

It seems a similar situation at the moment at Newcastle – and all we need is that first win – and we almost got it last night.

Comments welcome.



Tags: Coaching · Newcastle News · Other News



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175 responses so far ↓

  • 1 Indian Magpie // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:33 AM

    ED

    I would say it is similar to when he left AGAIN! and JFK (sounds like an airport) joined. Crazy gang Mk 2

  • 2 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:34 AM

    If the players carried out the game plan to almost perfection Ed, then the game plan was shite.

  • 3 Marty-Toon // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:39 AM

    9Marty-Toon // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:33 AM

    Hotdog
    The difference is that Man U play their young defenders throughout a couple of years in the cup etc to give them some mins on the pitch and have them around the senior players to give confidence when they’re actually needed because of injury.
    We bring in Good and have Tavernier and yet it’ll be a couple of years before they’re utilized.

    Willo in my opinion is just like Andy o’brien when he played.
    Always good for a mistake and think of it when o’brien played we were in Europe and had a good squad yet useless Cb.
    And that was a time when we spent money on players.
    We ended up spending money on the likes of Boumsong,Bramble and O’Brien- any wonder we never won anything?
    We haven’t been good at picking out good centre halves

  • 4 Marty-Toon // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:42 AM

    Indian
    You’re not far off there.
    It is like the time when KK kicked his dummy outa the pram n left us in the mire

  • 5 hotdog // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:43 AM

    Marty – Totally Agree, Mr Carr needs to concentrate all his efforts on CB’s

    Going back to Ferdinand remember when Bale when flying past him for Spurs goal. One mistake, if you can call it that with that speed merchant, and he gets slated. Our defenders make error after error it is beyhond a joke

  • 6 boater // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:44 AM

    As I recall, it wasn’t just the win that restored belief but the switch to 4-3-3 with Owen playing behind a front two of Viduka and Martins. Keegan realised he needed to play his best players and switch the formation. Exactly what we need now – 4-3-1-2 Not playing this is why we are on a downward spiral. This is the way forward.

    Indian – JFK is an airport brainiac.

  • 7 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:44 AM

    TDS

    more than a fair point there

    and sirtoon – last thread

    i feel your pain. I’m not a ST holder but i’ve spent my fair share on trans-Atlantic flights to game and am going to the Bordeaux match next week as well. Even if MA did invest heavily, i’d still be worried about what AP would do with those players, as his entire 24 months here has proved to me at least

  • 8 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:46 AM

    I am harping on again but our problem is we have a full squad of players without one having genuine pace. Obertan is quick but doesnt run, HBA has great acceleration but wont run flat out over 50 yards, not his style.

    We need pace up front or out wide to stretch teams and create room for our creative players.

    We also need pace at the back….simmo and willo on the right half of the defence are too slow as a combo. Colo is equally as slow but usually has better positioning, santon is quite quick but still learning to defend consistently.

  • 9 Conaldo (The Wizard...Also Bestest Friends With Paul Scharner) // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:46 AM

    If we can reach 20 points or higher by Christmas, and spend wisely in January, then we still have a chance of a decent finish in the league. In my opinion.

  • 10 boater // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:47 AM

    It’s funny reading hotdog (normally a decent poster) and others discussing Williamson. He is not the greatest all-round performer, but by virtue of him playing in a heavy number of positive results/performances since he’s been here – why are you supposing he is the reason he are struggling so? You are scapegoating in order to find a quick solution to a wider problem. We always do it, and normally it means singling out players.

    The problem is endemic.

  • 11 Marty-Toon // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:48 AM

    Maybe MA is off talking to Beckham to sign for a few bob a week?
    One thing the guy would give us is a decent dead ball situation,he’s worth a lot of goals in that sense

  • 12 Indian Magpie // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:49 AM

    bring back geremi

  • 13 Jonny // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:50 AM

    ———————Krul————————

    Perch——Colo———-Willo——–Santon

    ————Tiote———-Anita—————-

    Ben Arfa——–Marveaux————-Cisse

    ———————-Ba————————

    Need Ben Arfa back ASAP so our team can start shaping up like this.

  • 14 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:51 AM

    Boater

    I think Williamson is poor but last night the whole defence was terrible for both goals.

    Willo was left two against one with jones and jerome. Where was everyone else?

    The team as a whole has been shocking with the odd exception.

  • 15 Conaldo (The Wizard...Also Bestest Friends With Paul Scharner) // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:51 AM

    There are what, 54 points available after new year? We could still win the league man :)

    I’m only joking please don’t lynch me.

  • 16 mark -ee- j-a-y // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:52 AM

    Difference this time tho is that the manager can see we are in a mess and wont just run away at the 1st sign of trouble as a certain `messiah` did.
    If keegan loved the toon as much as i do and am sure every1 else on here he WOULDNT OF WALKED BECAUSE IT WAS OBVIOUS WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IF HE DID. On the day keegan walked i said 2 many of my felklow toon fans that we would get relageted that season and look what happened.

    King Kev?

    more like

    Coward Kev

    for me…

  • 17 hotdog // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:54 AM

    Boater – I aim to please :-)

    Of course we have other problems but he is a big one. i dont blame AP for the fact we did not sign a CB but the regime. Dont let last years good results fool you, you must be able to see how poor he is. I ll say again its not his fault he should not be at this level. Anywhere near this level!

  • 18 jesperfuglsang - captain of the lemon crew // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:55 AM

    Wizard…so you are saying there is still a chance ;D lol

  • 19 Les Grossman // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:57 AM

    Hotdog
    Spot on mate.
    Boater hasnt a clue if he thinks that the team did not need any strengthening in the summer!!

    98% of us on here (Approx) knew that we would be asking for trouble if we didnt strengthen…..CB positon in particular!!!

  • 20 Marty-Toon // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:58 AM

    Boater
    Well he doesn’t instill confidence in the back line for one
    He is tall yet does vary little in set plays apart from give away free kicks
    When on the ball he rarely plays the ball on the ground and often his passing is way off

    He’s not he only one to blame,it’s a team game but you’d think with his height and the time he’s spent in the PL that he’d be a more decent player.
    I don’t agree with people sayin he’s only a conference player,he’d do quite well in the championship or maybe beside a dominant CB like Huth or Hangeland but certainly looks a weak link in our back line.
    From yesterdays game the 2nd goal Collo didn’t look much better and if it had of been Willo that let his man go then he woulda got slated by people on here yet t was Willo that got the blame.
    He was beaten in the air by Jones whom is twice as strong as him n bigger

  • 21 hotdog // Nov 29, 2012 at 11:59 AM

    Indian Magpie – I have just remembered another oooh the list is endless “Frank Dumas” its like a bloody horror film our Centre Back signings :-)

  • 22 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:00 PM

    I’d rather have Williamson playing than Taylor at the moment. All this talk about missing 11 first team players – Hatem is the only one that would even make my team.

    Cabaye is a good player – a very good player – but if we’re playing 4-4-2, I’d rather stick two bulldogs in midfield and play two out and out wingers who actually feel like attacking.

  • 23 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:01 PM

    marty

    I made that point. At least willo tracked back and lost the header…colo just let his man go.

    You would have thought when we aren’t playing well the team would not be making lazy mistakes like that to throw away the good work they did.

  • 24 Les Grossman // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:02 PM

    Boater your analogy of Williamosn playing in more wins than defeats…..
    Could this not be because he hasnt played too many games and when he does…its usually against lesser oppostion? Reason for this….go on what do you reckon….injuries to First choice players, better players, or suqad rotations in games we are expected to win…no more oprions….pick number 1 or number 2 please.

    Fact remains, us that were there last night idntified one weak link in the team…..you guessed it…….98% of newcastle fans ant be wrong surely?

  • 25 Indian Magpie // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:03 PM

    Hot Dog,

    i am going home from office, but

    There is another one for you

    David Rozenhal

  • 26 Moe-NUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:03 PM

    hotdog
    that’s my point too, “Willo is not the only problem but he is a BIG ONE”
    tactics, team spirit, selections .. plenty of problems exist everywhere .. and making excuses is Not Good ..
    it’s gonna be foolish if we don’t buy players (defenders) this winter, NO its not a panic buy! but we needed CB as long as I remember!

  • 27 Les Grossman // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:05 PM

    TDS
    I would rather play Wills than Taylor at the minute also….
    We’d be even moire frigged if we played a CB with an Hamstring tear at the back I believe!!

  • 28 cadete // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:05 PM

    Boater
    That is the biggest load of nonsence I’ve ever heard 4312? Lol what are u on about? And Williamson is a major liability as is Simpson and Guti! Go back to your football manager you muppet

  • 29 alex84 // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:07 PM

    I think we should take into account that it was a better performance than Southampton, but that was not hard, Ba and Cisse cant play together its as simple as that, how Jonas is still playing is beyond me, even the commentator said “Alan Pardew really needs to have a look at Jonas, and why he is picking him, as he is offering nothing” if we see it, the commentators see it, why the hell can’t the man in charge not see it,
    Fair play to Anita who ran his socks off, he has come from a team that keeps possession, are patient in there play and have fantastic movement off the ball, to a team who deem it a race to turn defence into a attack with one direct pass up top, to two static centre forwards, it’s the same old story, style of play is shocking, no link up play at all.

  • 30 hotdog // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:07 PM

    Indian – Just as well your doing one ;-)

  • 31 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:08 PM

    cadete

    I’m not sure what your point is there.

    4312 is a formation. We played it against Aston Villa earlier this year.

    Erm…

  • 32 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:10 PM

    The only advantage to playing jonas I can see is in a central defence role. And even then not as first choice.

    If he plays DM he can sweep around the left hand side of the pitch allowing santon and the left sided player to get forward.

    But if Jonas does play DM he cant do it in a two man central midfield, he needs to be part of a 3 for that.

  • 33 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:11 PM

    markeejay

    agree about keegan

    but pardew not leaving probably has something to do with him never being able to find a better job than us

    england? ha. what a farce

    and TDS

    tayls has been poor this year, but willo takes the cake by a mile. at least taylor is there putting his body on the line and block shots. can’t stand to see that stupid, dejected face of williamson after an error of his, trotting back looking into the distance. sack up, son! focus on the upcoming ocrner you needlessly gave away!

  • 34 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:13 PM

    matty

    I know what you mean, but Taylors arrogance angers me in the same way Pardews does. I’ve just never liked the guy. All this hometown hero crap – the smug **** couldn’t wait to get away until we offered him a big contract.

  • 35 boater // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:14 PM

    Williamson is not the core problem. The problem is endemic which means that it starts to affect everything – as one of our less technically gifted players he will probably start showing signs of a lack of confidence first. So the mob sniff blood and off they go.

    We had our strongest backline and 8 full internationals in total out against Swansea -who had 2 or 3. So how in that particular situation can can we blame lack of summer strengthening? If we throw money at it January will that change the tactical approach to games in the longrun? We could throw a hundred million at the squad- sure it would help but it’s not the core issue.

    I was gutted we didn’t invest in the summer, but that’s not why we lost to 4 mid-table teams on the trot.

  • 36 cadete // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:16 PM

    Tds I dunno what your on about you would drop cabaye and play Williamson in front of saylor! Enough said

  • 37 Big Pappa Cissé // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:16 PM

    One thing I have noticed about Taylor is that he loves waving his hands around like they are on fire when trying to organise the defence :) . Never seen a player do it do much

  • 38 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:17 PM

    not naming names as I think that generates debate about the wrong thing, more want to address the positions we need to fill not the players.

    We need a CB, fullback and pacey striker/winger in Jan.

    Obviously more would be a bonus but we are covered well enough in other areas until the summer I think.

  • 39 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:19 PM

    BPC

    But then Taylor’s always out of position himself!

    cadete

    Your previous comment randomly – and nonsensically – insulting boater has already shown you up enough. Give it a rest, please, there’s enough keyboard warriors on here as it is.

  • 40 hotdog // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:20 PM

    OK I said i wouldnt go to hard on Williamson on here but you guys have enticed me in, like one of those lovely ladies in those Amsterdam windows haha

    1st Goal last night – Not his man that scored agreed. He headed that ball just around the six yard box. Id want my Man Mountain Centre Back to be clearing and reading that situation. Ill cut him some slack on that one, just!

    2nd Goal – The Stoke lad that delivers the ball has all day to look up and float that ball on a diagonal. Now as soon as that ball is played to that players feet id be squeezing up on line with Colo and Simmo to play him offside (again reading the situation). Williamson dosnt, he thinks ill track this lad all the way back and clear with a header (even though im up against Jones who is good in the air). As soon as he went backwards he was in trouble as he left himself isolated one on one. Im not doubting Colo was also at fault (lack of pace again) but it should not have got to that position.

  • 41 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:21 PM

    boater

    I think the question for me is why Pardew persists on playing Williamson. It’s not a criticism of the guy himself, but given that our possession & passing stats are the worst in the league, you’d think having a composed CB who is comfortable on the ball in his place would at least be worth a try.

    So it’s Perch or Tavernier for me – but I’m not suggesting Tavernier is anywhere near ready, just that he’s calm and very pacy, and would learn a lot playing alongside Colo.

  • 42 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:24 PM

    cadete

    TDS makes more than a valid point about cabaye. in a 442 he is obsolete. redundant. works hard but we have a team that is above simply grafting and clinging for a draw or a lead. we just don’t have a manager who is

    i got slated last year when cabaye was out for a bit guthrie was having his best spell with us, in a 442. said i thought guthrie merited a place before cabaye. if we play a three man midfield, or 5 or whatever, that’s when he comes alive. other than that, no thanks. the cabaye excuse is not valid

  • 43 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:27 PM

    I’m no longer blaming simmo and willo for anything at the club.

    We know they aren’t good enough and I guess the manager does by the fact he wanted debuchy and said he wanted a dominant, goal scoring CB in the summer.

    The board knew this too as they persued Debuchy and Douglas.

    We have no real options in the squad so these guys get a game, the fault is entirely with Llambias for these two playing.

    He runs the club in terms of negotiations of signings and he had the opportunity to pay more or to realise the deal was going no where and move onto another target.

    I remember Carr saying he would always give pards 3/4 names for each position so obviously other options were available just not persued as we wasted all summer chasing a player instead of being decisive.

  • 44 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:27 PM

    matty

    The frustrating thing last night way that Stoke actually scored once we’d STOPPED desperately clinging onto the lead. We’d just started to apply some pressure and look for a second, and then the goals came. Will that convince Pardew that we should have just battened down the hatches for 45 minutes? Unfortunately, probably yes.

  • 45 Big Pappa Cissé // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:27 PM

    Tavernier is better on the ball than Willo and Simmo combined IMO

  • 46 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:30 PM

    well TDS,

    the same can be said for last night. Pardew thought we deserved the win. It could be argued, but only that. I don’t think that wild display merited anything about a draw

    now pards will stick AGAIN with the 442. marvs AGAIN will not get a fair run of games just as raylor, willo, obertan, and (some cases last year) perch all have undeservedly

    the guy is a joke

  • 47 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:30 PM

    TDS

    from what i have seen tavernier isn’t a CB and certainly not a prem centre back, maybe try him full back

    Perch I like at CB with collo next to him, he stood up and did well there last year. I guess for stoke Pardew wanted the height of willo but seeing as he fouls and doesn’t win loads in the air I think he is a waste of squad member but until we sign somebody better he will be used.

  • 48 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:31 PM

    BPC

    He’s looked good yeah, but he’s young and naive, maybe too much imo.

    Remember him being torn to pieces by the Atromotis (spelling?) winger in our EL qualifying game? :|

  • 49 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:31 PM

    regardless of the situation injury wise, perch should have been at CB instead of willo, tavs for simmo. at the very least willo should have been benched.

  • 50 cadete // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:33 PM

    look at last night we didnt have cabaye, what was the game plan? punt it and hope for the best, given cabaye has probably not been fully fit all season, but to say the only creative midfielder we have should not be played in any formation is rubbish! 1 example last night was tiotes backpass to krul, it nearly knocked him over hit him square in the chest!

  • 51 boater // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:33 PM

    Cadete – Quite the charmer but you’re wasting your time flirting with me big boy – I’m taken.

    TDS – Yes but during these crisis spells there is always the tendency to tinker with things and make matters worse. Williamson is a known quantity – not the greatest defender in the league but too many times he’s played in positive results. Our approach play is so muddled it’s inviting pressure on the defenders and they end up looking worse than they are. I can say this because I’ve been aware of this phenomenon at the TOon for – oh I don’t know 25 years.. it never changes.

  • 52 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:33 PM

    ah, i’m off.

    i’m tired of arguing the same points, the fans in most cases whether we like pards or not seeing what is wrong and not a f****** thing changes. this guy really is a class A idiot. and the excuses….f*** me

  • 53 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:33 PM

    Matty

    Agree marv deserves a run of maybe 5 games from the start to see what he can do.

    His prem league start at everton was never going to go well, he was up against an inform pienaar and baines so had to spend most time defending which isn’t his game.

    I’d love a front 4 of these in the run up to christmas but doubt we will see it

    ——————-ben arfa———————–
    marv———–cisse———————ba

  • 54 hotdog // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:34 PM

    TS – “I’m no longer blaming simmo and willo for anything at the club.”

    Im gonna hold you to that can we get mattyNUFC to do the same with Mr Pardew :-)

  • 55 toonking // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:36 PM

    what frustated me about last night was how good the performance was in general because it just does not look right how we can do so well against team like stoke where we feel unlucky yet against southampton we feel deservedly to loose and i had seen this quite a lot of the time last season where we did poor against teams such as QPR yet excelent against teams like manure

  • 56 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:36 PM

    TS

    you doubt it?

    there isn’t a chance in hell with AP picking the team

  • 57 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:38 PM

    hotdog

    they may be at fault for goals…but it’s not their fault…they just simply aren’t good enough.(more so willo than simmo, although he isn’t great either) They do the best they can but get found out.

  • 58 Les Grossman // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:40 PM

    Matty
    Thought you were off??

    Traar

  • 59 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:40 PM

    hotdog

    no chance. and i say that in all seriousness. i’ll give credit if we turn it around but four defeats is four defeats. until then….

  • 60 Les Grossman // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:40 PM

    Oh and stop swearing please or ROTONDA will tell ED.

  • 61 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:41 PM

    matty

    I would love to know why marv isn’t getting a game. I remember last year pardew was clear why he wasn’t playing ben arfa (whether we as fans agreed or not with him).

    I would also like to know we experiemented with 433 last year to good effect then abandoned it this year and haven’t even tried it despite our terrible form.

    I’m not saying I could manage better than Pardew by any stretch but I would just love to know the process behind his decision making.

  • 62 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:42 PM

    les

    you’ve already admitted you like s*** and i don’t.

    you’re first comment of any day is to generalize everyone as ‘W@NK@S’ and then fail to add anything to any given debate.

    so endearing you are. now do me a favour and lick it up you little tit :D

  • 63 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:45 PM

    Nothing wrong with reporting swearing. People of all ages read this blog so people should keep it respectful.

  • 64 boater // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:46 PM

    Trasnfer sage – because Ba was only willing to stay if he was given a central striking role – which means Cisse on the left – which we tried and it didn’t work.

    Marveaux looks good one minute -i.e. Europe in a slower less physical encounter, then feeble the next i.e. the Everton game when he was withdrawn. No reason why he can’t play in the league but it means Pardew adapting the formation.

  • 65 toonking // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:47 PM

    @TS post 47
    i would just stick with simmo and willo as our CB and FB as what could happen is starting tavernier as a FB could give ashley more excuses for not bringing in debuchy as all he will need to say is “you have raylor next year who was part of the best defensive line up in the league and while he is out you have perch anita or tavernier already as cover” or make tavernier look rubbish to bloggers who have been slating sammy and fergie recently.

  • 66 Ginger // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:48 PM

    I missed the first half of the match last night lads, how did we do? I saw the second half in which I thought we did rather better then our past matches although we conceded those two goals of silly mistakes.

  • 67 toonking // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:49 PM

    ginger the firs half was a boring half where nothing much happened.

  • 68 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:50 PM

    Boater

    That was my reason as well, to accommodate Ba.

    But it’s just not goo enough. Even if it means we lose Ba well we will just have to get over it. Surely a manager doesn’t upset the balance if a team to accommodate one player?

    If that’s the genuine reason we go 442 even though cisse and Ba doesn’t work then pardew has to go.

    That is far worse than picking a team some Dont agree with or not picking a formation because he believes 442 is his best one etc.

  • 69 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:52 PM

    Toonking

    Maybe not start tavernier but perch is far better than willo in my opinion. So much more calm, solid tackle and looks much more confident too.

  • 70 bosamuelson // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:53 PM

    I have to admit, all this slagging and negative stuff is not needed.

    Yes I do not need to outline the problems, there is enough of that going around. But sport is so much more than tactics and planning. OK Pardews tactics, I think need improvement, but just think, he is sticking with both Ba and Cisse. What happens if that clicks after the new year. We all know there abilities. But that won’t come if you don’t stick with the two of them.

    I think it is clear that Ba has been the problem. This is due to the jealousy shown after Cisse was getting all the plaudits. Ba spat his dummy out and this is the result. Pardew isn’t going to drop them and in my opinion this is correct. Unfortunately…for the short term, but long term I think it will pay off. Ba and Cisse to some extent have to learn they can both play together and both get goals, assists and the plaudits.

    On a side note, do you notice that both Ba and Cisse will rather take a long shot than pass to one another. Look at the Stoke goal. It was far from team work that got the goal.

    I may get bombed for this but I don’t think things are too bad. Europe is going well, cross fingers and the Prem was always going to suffer because of it. Confidence, I think was lost due to injuries to key players and suspensions. It wasn’t so much as key players more as the teams leaders.

    Jonas Gutz troubles me, and the commentators last night mentioned it. Pardew should be looking and expecting more for him and I think most would agree. It is his work rate that gets him on the teamsheet he is lost going forward!!!

    Get the heads up lads, the lads on the pith will come good and so will Pards. You will see!

    Cheers S

  • 71 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:58 PM

    bosamuelson

    I think Ba and cisse styles do not compliment each other.

    They are both good finishers but neither link play well or work the channels to stretch teams.

    I just think they could play together for 5 years and not see any change.

    Neither wants to adapt their game.

    I think both on the pitch is the right call but need them as part of a front 3 with ben arfa/marvoux

  • 72 Conaldo (The Wizard...Also Bestest Friends With Paul Scharner) // Nov 29, 2012 at 12:59 PM

    I thought that with ba playing deeper role yesterday, him and cisse didn’t get in each others way. I knownthey haven’t clicked yet, but when you are short on players, you can not play 1 of yourbest.

    Ba playing behind cisse may work, and it looks like pards could be opting for that. Could work.

  • 73 AMEOBI // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:01 PM

    Someone posted this yesterday which I think is the best comment I’ve seen.

    Lets be clear. We did not deserve to lose that game. Stoke are an abomination of a football team. However, we created nothing. Our goal was from a goalkeeping mistake. Demba Ba is without doubt the most selfish player I have ever seen in my lifetime. He NEVER passes the ball, Cisse was through on goal and he refused to give him it. He refuses to play left wing, even though it helps the team. He is only interested in number one. Thats why he has a release clause in his contract. Thats why he demanded £100k a week. He may be our highest scorer, but seeing as Papiss Cisse finally got himself a decent goal, we should show faith in him and take Ba down a few notches with a shift on the left hand side. We weren’t bad tonight, but we weren’t great either. Relegation battle perhaps?

    I along with whoever said that think we should sell Demba Ba and replace with a LW, Remy perhaps would be great. My opinion I think Pardew is scared for Ba as he’s trying to keep him happy for an individual and not for the team, Pardew doesn’t want to lose him its obvious!

  • 74 Charlie in the Gallowgate // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:02 PM

    I’ll throw one in
    Formations Formations what the !!!
    Do we need to play with 2 centre halfs
    Drop Williamson
    revolutionary formation 3-2-4-1
    play with 3 at the back
    Santon —– Coloccini —–Simpson
    Bigi—– Tiote as Defensive midfielders
    Marvo —- Bigi—Ba—-Ben Arfa attacking midfield
    Cisse on his own up front

  • 75 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:06 PM

    I need to ask –

    Why would Remy, douglas or Debuchy want to join a team battling relegation?

  • 76 Jail for Ashley // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:08 PM

    This old argument again,Keegan walked because Mashley repeatedly lied to him,or maybe he was completely straight up honest guv and the law courts that awarded him 2M pounds were wrong.

  • 77 toonking // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:14 PM

    TDS
    are you saying then that cabaye tiote santon HBA ba and cisse are all leaving?

  • 78 bosamuelson // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:14 PM

    TDS we are not battling for relegation. It is a ridiculous statement.

    The team will get going. Just be patient!

  • 79 toonking // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:18 PM

    the truth about newcastle ATM i think is our squad has not been able to settle due to injuries and suspentions also the summer transfer window probably knock confidence down on the team and now the run of results has made it get terribly low confidence but now cisse has score so he might be boosted also we were unlucky but still did well and we have our captain back who i think is key.

  • 80 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:30 PM

    toonking

    …Eh?

    bosamuelson

    Have a look at our fixtures from now till January, please. It’s not pretty viewing! We’re 4 points off the drop zone now, and I really do not fancy us pulling away between now and the transfer window.

  • 81 AMEOBI // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:31 PM

    Guessing you didn’t even read post 73, take a read a let me know what you think?

  • 82 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:31 PM

    Make that 2 points, rather.

  • 83 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:33 PM

    Ameobi

    I agree on Ba, but how can anyone say that Stoke are an abomination of a football team when they had more possession than us, and played less long balls than us.

  • 84 toonking // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:35 PM

    TDS
    saying decent players like debuchy will not join a relegation battling team is like saying decent players we have such as HBA will not want to stay in a relegation battling team

  • 85 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:36 PM

    ameobi

    just speculation about Ba, nothing proven, although that seems likely from what pardew, ba’s agent and the way the team lines up now.

    If that’s the case no player is bigger than the club, offload him and gets a pacey winger/forward in.

    The problem is that Pardew knows all to well that when a striker goes he might not get another right away. (had to wait 6 months for ba after carroll left and a year for cisse)

  • 86 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:38 PM

    toonking

    Well no… it’s not…

    We actually have to choose to sell players. They can’t just get up and leave, can they?

    Maybe they won’t want to stay, no, but unless MA panics again they will not be leaving.

  • 87 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:39 PM

    TDS/toonking

    Ben arfa, Ba, cabaye, santon all joined when we never looked like being a top half team never mind top 5 so no worry about them leaving.

    We are on par with most prem teams or above them so can only see cabaye/ben arfa/cisse moving to a regular champs league club like man utd, man city, chelsea, arsenal or abroad.

  • 88 AMEOBI // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:39 PM

    TDS, but you get the point, I’d love Ba to leave in January so we can dominate the 4-3-3 again, with Tiote, Cabaye and maybe Sissoko in midfield if the rumours are right, I’ve no time to panic just yet i think we’ll turn up the results just after xmas with our current team.

  • 89 AMEOBI // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:42 PM

    Transfer Sage

    Yeah exactly, I was just furious with Ba’s decisions on the pitch seriously, I hope he’s off really do.

    Anyways thanks for taking notice, i’m off for work.. enjoy

  • 90 bettyswallocks // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:43 PM

    Pardew has been here 2 years and people have now realised that his brand of football is not what we want to watch long term.
    Why delay the inevitable and subject the fans to more of the same with the added risk of relegation.

    Pardews mindset obviously stems from his playing days when he was a non ballplaying hoof it away defender.

    We are the paying public and the owner needs to be made aware that we are not buying into this cumbersome style of football.

  • 91 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:45 PM

    I am baffled as to how people can seriously suggest that selling our top scorer is a good idea. If he did go he would have to be replaced and we are not going to get big money for him. And what is to say that it would make the slightest difference to tactics.Pardew could just as easily play Shola alongside Cisse as switch to 442.

  • 92 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:45 PM

    Ameobi

    Agreed, completely. Cisse is a truly wonderful finisher when he’s confident.

    I felt that part of our success last season, AND the reason that Ba and Cisse never scored together, was that Pardew was setting the team up to provide entirely for one player – first Ba, then Cisse.

    This season he’s bailed on it, and is trying to accomodate both.

    Ben Arfa has shown he can chip in with goals, and Marveaux seems to get into very good positions (although we haven’t seen to much in the finishing department yet), so I really think that would be exciting to watch.

    F’ck the defence. I’d rather watch us really have a go and lose every now and again, than keep trying (and failing) to hold onto 1 goal leads all the time. It’s pathetic.

  • 93 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:46 PM

    switch to 433

  • 94 hotdog // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:46 PM

    bosamuelson – You sure about that, ridiculous!!

    You can normally count on a few bad teams that get cut adrift but i dont see that his year. Look at QPR that are rooted now are you certain they wont get a run going under sloppy chops!

  • 95 ToonDownSouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:47 PM

    bettyswallocks

    It all stems from having no one above Pardew’s head who knows anything about football, and hence does not understand the issues.

    Pardew is the most senior ‘footballing man’ at the club, unfortunately.

  • 96 Ian Toon // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:48 PM

    bettyswallocks—- BandB your not!

  • 97 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:50 PM

    Betty does Pardews mindset stem from when he was a defender who hoofed the ball? He played midfield.

  • 98 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:50 PM

    tequilla

    I dont want him sold, of course I want him to stay.

    I think to get the best out of cabaye, ben arfa, cisse, tiote and anita we should be playing 433/4231/451 etc

    If the whole system is compromised just for one player it’s not Ba’s fault, it’s weak management.

    If Pardew thinks that 442 is the way to get best results, fair enough. I’f he is just doing it just to keep Ba happy then he needs a serious talking to.

  • 99 mumbaNi // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:51 PM

    Its good that we played better – that much is at least owed to those who paid to travel to the game.
    But we shouldnt have sat back at 1-0 – our record suggests we cant manage it this season. Yet again i was so annoyed with our substitutions – made far too late again and when we were 2-1 down. Both could have been brought on at 70/75mins to give fresh legs and maybe hit stoke on the counter.. they got 10mins each for nothing.
    I liked Anita on the right, santon looked bright – still would like to see him on the left wing showing attacking intent – very disappointed in Tiote this season. He is a great player.. but if we have to sell to buy in January to help the squad he is the person i would be looking at for 15million+

  • 100 toonking // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:51 PM

    relegation fights and top 4 battles i’ve always split into two groups i have the group that will be in them battles from the start and the group in the battles from around january so ATM the only teams i put in relegation battle are QPR reading villa wigan west ham and swansea.

  • 101 bosamuelson // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:51 PM

    @ comment 73.

    I totally agree about Ba. He is not good for the team. My first comment tries to say basically what you said.

    TDS. It is November – again we are not in a relegation battle.

  • 102 toonking // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:52 PM

    relegation fights and top 4 battles i’ve always split into two groups i have the group that will be in them battles from the start and the group in the battles from around january so ATM the only teams i put in relegation battle are QPR reading villa wigan west ham southampton norwich and swansea.

  • 103 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:55 PM

    TS i was referring more to Ameobi. But I dont think it is simply playing 442 to keep Ba happy. Don`t think Pardew would sabotage results just to make a player happy. Seems a little far fetched to me.

  • 104 Mister Tuff // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:56 PM

    Jail @#76.
    I have been re-reading all the stuff about the reasons for the Andy Carroll sale, Barton transfer and Nolan sale also Bartons tweets re the reasons he left (I know before anybody says -Barton may not be the most reliable) the bonus sheets and the transcriptions of Llambias in the bar rant.
    Sometimes when reading accounts as they happen/at an earlier stage it is not easy to obtain a perspective on what exactly you are reading about or its relevance.
    Sometimes re-visiting a topic at a later date enables you to see things in a different light and possibly obtain a true/believable perspective of the events.
    You mentioned the KK court case.
    A definite theme which now appears so obvious is the dishonour/lies from the management at Newcastle to the “staff” at Newcastle.
    The football world in the UK is quite tightly knit, meaning players know colleagues at other clubs, managers know other managers etc etc. and I’m sure gossip/chat is exchanged regularly between all parties.
    I therefore think that if I believe the accounts of Keegan/Barton/Nolan etc perhaps Newcastle would be the last club I would want to work for.

  • 105 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 1:58 PM

    tequila

    I have always said that as well, sure pardew wouldn’t do it just to keep one player happy as you could argue it could upset the other 10.

    But on our showings this season I really cant think of any other reason he persists with 442.

  • 106 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:06 PM

    TS take last night for example , we beat Stoke last year with a 442 and we all know playing Stoke is going to be a battle. For the majority of the game it worked well. I am not saying that 442 is better or worse than any other system they all have advantages and disadvantages. Pardew clearly feels more comfortable with a 442 but I would expect to see variances in formation from him over the season, same as last. I think the problems we have at the moment are not just down to formation.

  • 107 Les Grossman // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:10 PM

    Matty
    I only responded to youyr claim that you were off.
    I also requested rather politely for you to stop swearing, you failed to take on my request and I was only doing it on behalf of the doomlord king W@nk@ Rotonda.

    And PS, where did I “generalise everyone” all as being w@nk@s?? I cant recall that at all??

    However, i did get bites from a few, you included who obviously believe I was referring to them, and therfore by default do actually consider themselves as W@nk@s?

    Now be a good little boy and carry out your wee threat of leaving, but this time dont stamp your feet as petulantly as the last time.

  • 108 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:10 PM

    Just to make you all smile…check out the comment somebody left on this. Comment number 2.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20534947

  • 109 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:14 PM

    TS I think that comment may have come from Kets.

  • 110 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:15 PM

    tequilla

    I dont deny 442 works…it is very good for man utd with van persie and rooney upfront/

    What you need though is pace out wide, good wide men (valenica and nani/young, then attacking fullbacks in evra/rafael)

    We were good 44 this time last year as Ba partnered Shola/Best which works quite well. Also obertan was one side and guti, who both played ok in that time. Or raylor out wide who put in a decent cross)

    Now though we are much more suite to 433 with cisse a good loan striker, ben arfa and cabaye to run the show and tiote and anit able to hold together the midfield.

  • 111 Munster Mag // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:15 PM

    Keeeeeeeeegan , Keeeeeeeegan, Keeeeeegan …..I’d have him back in a heartbeat now. Can you imagine a rich new owner, and KK as manager for the season, before he moves into a presidential role. I would LUVE it !!!!

  • 112 Ian Toon // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:18 PM

    Solano- hello. Our lifestyles seem to preclude us from posting at the same time. Reading your flurry of posts largely on the recent history,
    workings of the club I thought I should comment. Your right to focus on our last relegation. Re our current predicament your also right to largely absolve Pardew of much of the blame. We clearly have a problem and it’s right to focus on the cause and more importantly how to address it. Discounting Ashley not being the owner anytime soon . As I have said many times Ashley will seek to rectify his all too obvious mistake of not buying in the summer . He understands the need to protect his investment . He will realise the likely outcome if he doesn’t. He’s a business man. Your right to make the point that the fans don’t need to be reminded to support the team they always have. As an aside, your mention of the Hull City game reminds me of Xisco’s goal scoring debut – whatever happened to him! Back on course, we can look to Ashley to produce a transfer kitty there is no need for you to organise a fans forum – mind you at £1 a head it could go towards a transfer fund or to ensure Catchy gets a good haircut. I digress. I expect Ashley to make a strong move into the transfer market which is sorely needed to replace not least those clowns Simpson and Williamson. Ashley did not listen to Pardew on bolstering the squad with so many more games in prospect. Pardew was left to get on with it. He’ll be listening now and has to dig deeper. Given the known constraints whilst recognising the cause of our difficulties. I realise this does not solve your envisaged problem for the long term. But as Eric and Ernie said( almost certainly with Ashley in mind) it’s not that he’s mean it’s just that his pockets are long and his arms are short.

  • 113 hotdog // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:21 PM

    TS – You gotta laugh or you would cry :-)

    I LOVE KEVIN KEEGAN xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx anybody that has a pop at this great man of our club will have me and errmmmmm Ibiza to answer too. OK you got it you lot!

  • 114 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:22 PM

    TS not averse to the idea of 433 , if we went that way though would be more tempted to rotate Ba and Cisse with Ba probably getting preference up front than play him out wide. I will drop the Obertan bomb now and suggest him and HBA making up the front 3.
    Please feel free everyone to tell me useless he is and could not even cross the road..

  • 115 Ian Toon // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:24 PM

    Munster- Behave . Stop it . We’re still paying him off for his non adherence to terms of contract claim. Cost us £2 million. We have a good manager.

  • 116 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:27 PM

    tequeila

    rather have Ba left with cisse central, gets them both on the pitch together, ba is still a goal threat from left.

    I’m not convicned on obertan, why cant he just knock the ball down the line and use his pace? i just dont understand. You need confidence to be a winger as no matter how good you are you will get tackled a lot trying to beat a men, it happens to the best often enough. But not against trying him as he is the only player in the squad with real pace.

    I’d have a front three of Ba/cisse/ben arfa/obertan/marvoux……take your pick of 3 of those 5.

    I’d then have cabaye/anita/tiote in the middle. Maybe play ben arfa as attacking mid until cabaye returns as I like him central.

  • 117 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:34 PM

    TS understand a lot of people don`t rate him but I think he has improved.He has been the stand out player in a couple of the Euro games. Ba did not really produce on the left in a 433 last season. Centrally with everyone fit would go Tiote Jonas and Cabaye.
    Again Jonas is scapegoat of the month but for me is still worth his place, though perhaps not on the wing.

  • 118 Ian Toon // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:35 PM

    boater- trust me in recent games Williamson has been a major weakness. I don’t single out players for criticism but he has been found wanting in the air as much as for pace of late. His power of recovery is such that we struggle to play a higher line. It’s clear that
    Oppositions are not only targeting Simpson but Williamson as well. Perch played at CB against Spurs and might be an option against Wigan.

  • 119 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:38 PM

    tequila

    The only place i would have for jonas is a DM in a 3 man midfield. Not in a 2 man and certainly not on the wing like you say.

    I would prefer anita though as he is much better with the ball, and is starting to show it.

    I think Ba did well on a left, it’s not his best position but he did a decent job and came pretty close to scoring a few times.

  • 120 Ian Toon // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:38 PM

    Simpson, Williamson and Obertan are not included in our 2013 Calendar.

  • 121 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:43 PM

    Ian CH is a major problem for us. The options are not great. A struggling Willo or 5 foot 7 Perch.?
    There maybe some games we can get away with having such a small CH but on balance I would still probably play safe with Willo..

  • 122 jimiley // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:44 PM

    People are delusional if they think Pardew is going to get the sack. Pardew and the backroom staff on EIGHT year contracts would cost 20 million in compensation. Ashers would not spend that in a generation on players so will never pay it in compensation. If we go down then Pardew will bring us back up again. He is a good Championship manager. We are now a yo yo club and can never classify ourselves as a big club. We last won the league in the Stone Age. All those fans are now dead. I do not mind watching the Toon in the Championship. I had some great days out at Watford and Peterborough etc. It was much more enjoyable watching the Toon win playing decent football instead of watching this dross and getting steamrolled by the top teams. Bring on the Championship if needs must. Keep the faith

  • 123 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:45 PM

    tequila

    Perch every time for me. He is so much better than Willo. Willo is just totally shot of confidence.

  • 124 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:47 PM

    jimiley

    I’m sure Ashley is not stupid enough to have no get out of the 8 year deal. He knows things can change very quickly so I bet there are all sorts of clauses in that contract.

  • 125 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:50 PM

    TS he is the better player by a mile, it`s just the lack of height that worries me. I could be persuaded by Anita over Jonas though, possibly. And yeah Jonas only in a 3 man midfield.

  • 126 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:52 PM

    Ian I can only assume Simmo was dropped from calendar because he is off in Jan and we have a replacement lined up and that Willo and Ober were dropped for aesthetic reasons.

  • 127 Munster Mag // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:53 PM

    Ian, Simpson is probably the best defender we have after Collo – in a purely defensive capacity. If you cant see that …..As for KK, do you mean his deserved costs etc for constructive dismissal/breach of contract ?

  • 128 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:53 PM

    The height issue would worry me if I never saw willo get out jumper by small likes like victor Moses.

    Really neither should be a long term CB for us. We need to make sure the squad is strengthened with 2 defended in jan or we could really suffer.

  • 129 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:55 PM

    Munster

    I think Simmo backs off too much, lets full backs run at him and get into the box. He is quite lazy sometimes getting back. He always manages to show the winger onto their strongest foot.

    I appreciate his efforts but he is not a good defender.

  • 130 terencelim // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:58 PM

    @jimiley, It’s simple. I think you should support Sunderland or Middlebrough as they can fulfill your ambition.

    And just a reminder we used to be one of the best club in Europe with great fan base and played some good football in Europe so we aint yo-yo club.

    Time to time again you’re proven wrong in this blog so just admit it simple as that don’t try to justify your points by twisting facts and where the club should be aiming and achieving. Same as all other Ashley apologists.

  • 131 hotdog // Nov 29, 2012 at 2:59 PM

    tequilamag – “I would still probably play safe with Willo..
    ” – Cheered my afternoon up hahaha

    jimiley – God your a glass half full sort of guy, i like it. Are you a motivational speaker? ;-)

  • 132 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:06 PM

    Hotgog, yeah I do get that. Says a lot about our options at the moment.

  • 133 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:13 PM

    one positive to take away from this (pending time proves we are in a relegation battle):

    middle table is always boring. at least the end of the season might prove entertaining stuff.

  • 134 Munster Mag // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:15 PM

    TS, I havent seen as many games recently as I would like ( broken telly, family fights !!! ) but I dont agree. he gets tighter than Santon, is quick, likes to tackle, and has cleared off the line plenty. I think many here feel he can defend ( have you seen any players give him a real riun around – i cant recall any but I agree that he is uncomfortable on the ball and poor going forward etc. IMO, santon is not a good defender ( in defensive terms ) but will hopefully improve.

  • 135 hotdog // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:16 PM

    I have followed this club for a fair few years and i can honestly say two things have stuck in my throat! (now now)

    Selling Sir Les wihtout a replacement lined up – Shearer got crocked and we went backwards from then and not investing in a quality Centre Half this season. It has done us massive damage when we should have improved the squad. Standing still is going backwards right?

  • 136 Munster Mag // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:18 PM

    terencelim, I have said before that JMiley may be a makem troll…..Jim, we are a big club, sorry…..

  • 137 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:19 PM

    munster

    I think your right santon doesn’t get that tight either, but i think he is getting better.

    Simpson I think just keeps backing off and lets people run into the box.

    Nobody gives him a run around as they dont need to. He offers them so much room to cross without beating him

  • 138 jimiley // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:22 PM

    Hotdog,
    My glass is always half full, but I am a realist. After 50 years watching the Toon, I expect nowt but failure. Ashers is not going to lead us to the promised land so I have accepted we are going nowhere.
    It makes me laugh reading the rubbish by the youngsters on this blog about who we are going to buy etc etc. Aint happening mate under this owner who merely wants to survive in Prem to pocket the profits.
    Also very funny is the talk of formations on this blog. 443 solves everything apparently!!!!! Utter bollocks. A good team can play any formation. Bad teams justify poor results because the formation is wrong. Eh? Get a life. Unfortunately we have weak players esp in midfield. If you create nowt you score nowt. Barca could play any formation you like and still skin us with 90% of the ball. We must simply wait for better times and a better owner but I fear I will not see them.

  • 139 toonarmydownsouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:22 PM

    Tequila
    Completly agree with your comments about demba
    Blaming the style of play on him this season is ridiculous do people genuinly think one player can dictate the entire team set up?
    Think its more likely that pardew has looked at the team and lack of investment relised we dont actually have any traditional wingers at the club except obertan!
    For me this season the biggest worry is the form of tiote cabs and colo although cabs underlying injury certainly explains why he’s been struggling!
    Ba is not a LW he played well still last season but wasnt hammering in crosses or anything he was constantly looking to get back stick if we want a 433 we need some wingers in ASAP cos benny wants to be central, guti is no longer a winger ober could do a job but that only leaves sammy marv n fergie
    Marv doesnt seem to have the backing of the management for what ever reason
    Fergie and sammy are no where near first team especially if fans really think we should be a regular in europe

  • 140 Transfer Sage // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:28 PM

    jimiley

    so why the sudden difference in quality from 433 and 442 when we use them?

    also I agree players are more important than formations but some systems get the best of otu certain players

    also we signed, cabaye, ben arfa, ba, cisse, tiote, santon….all had good proven records before they came here so ashley may not lead us to a league title but I don’t think we will yoyo

  • 141 lesh // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:35 PM

    From the little I saw in the MOTD highlights, I got the distinct impression that a number of heads were down and showing signs of despair. Lose a ball and walk away, no bite, no urgency in some players and some seemingly hiding.

    we need a big injection of incentive, purpose, ambi and the players’ll respond, I’m sure.

    Ok it’s water under the bridge, but the clubs performance in the summer window wouldn’t have and dare I say it, Pardew’s sense of purpose. He must’ve felt sick follwoing the short-sighted penny-pinching as deminstrated by Llambias. For the sake of a few quid, we wouln’t have been in the position we’re in now – involved in a relegation scrap and the season not half over!!

    Let’s hope the powers that be have reflected and have learned from the summer foray into the market – probably little or no chance of that I guess.

    Sorry folks, like a few on this site, my head’s going down too.

  • 142 Big Pappa Cissé // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:39 PM

    @ Tads

    Having no natural wingers is the exact reason we should not be playing 4-4-2 . Man United can do it because they have Valencia & Young whereas we have Fergie and Sammy (our only natural wingers IMO). If Ba and Cisse were playing for Man U they would score for fun because the service will come from out wide.

  • 143 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:39 PM

    TADS biggest concern for me at the moment is defence, a masive part of last season based on clean sheets and at the moment we always look vulnerable. We need Colo to get back up to pace and pray for no more injuries. Jan is the big one. can`t believe money will not be available for new defenders.

  • 144 Big Pappa Cissé // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:40 PM

    Not just hopeful long punts up field

  • 145 jimiley // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:42 PM

    Transfer Sage,
    We will yoyo because Ashley wants to keep us a mid table team. He will not spend to make us a top 4 team because that will cost serious money. He is content with mid table. But if he underspends we can land in trouble as is the case right now. Ashley wil relegate us. It may not happen this tear or next but ir will happen in the next few years because he merely wants “to get by.” And he will miscalculate. In any event, check out the Toon’s record. Half a dozen years in the Prem and a year or so to get promoted. Not exactly a yo yo club , but hardly an Arsenal or Everton. There are 7 or 8 regulars in the prem and the rest go backwards and forwards. Ashers is not going to change that statistic unfortunately.

  • 146 jimiley // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:48 PM

    Munster
    I am not a Mackem trog I was watching the Toon before you were born. Ankles Bennett mean anything to you? But its a sad fact that this club wins nowt and Ashley and Pardew will not change that fact. Neither will formations.

  • 147 Ruddy Marveaux-lous // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:51 PM

    On the topic that was mentioned earlier, I wouldn’t have Keegan back if he offered to do it for free and was the last manager on earth, but perhaps that is my own irreverent take on the perennial “bottler”.

    Seems like we performed pretty well but still lost. Doesn’t look too good does it. The night is always darkest before the dawn, keep the faith.

  • 148 Indian Magpie // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:51 PM

    no one should go through the ignominy of being called a mackem.

  • 149 Ruddy Marveaux-lous // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:57 PM

    Jimiley

    We’ve only ever been out of the Premier League once, and that was in 2009. We had been in it from 1993. Until our relegation we would have been considered “regulars” in the PL, unless you’re talking about the old First Division I think you’re mistaken.

  • 150 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 3:59 PM

    Jmiley I can see where you are coming from. Ashley will not try and buy trophies in say the way of an Abramovich. But I don`t think that makes it a given that we will sooner or later get relegated.. It makes more sense to me that Ashley will want to grow his investment and that can only be achieved by at the very least top 10 finishes. The big difference between the last time we were relegated is the club was in a mess and the fans wanted to lynch Ash. . By the time the transfer window came round he just wanted out. The club should be operating on a profit when the next figures are announced. Ash would not be stupid enough to put the club at risk when he has just got the finances turned round. Too much to lose.

  • 151 jimiley // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:00 PM

    Munster,
    How do you define a big club?
    A club which has a lot of supporters? Lagos in Africa has 70,000 watching games but has anybody heard of them? Many clubs get 50,000 gates throughout the world and some are poor clubs in third world countries.
    A club with a lot of money? Our owner keeps anything left over and he always claims we are skint.
    A club which wins things? That is my definition of a big club so it does not apply to us.
    Whats yours and what makes the Toon a Big club?

  • 152 Ruddy Marveaux-lous // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:00 PM

    Not even going to bother, I’ve accepted that this season is most probably a write off, we’ll probably finish outside the top ten or in and around it but the players (as well as the manager and owner) will have gained valuable experience to take on into the seasons that follow.

    Head up lads, there are worse things in life than supporting NUFC so let’s enjoy it eh?

  • 153 jimiley // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:01 PM

    Ruddy,
    You are right, I am talking about the last 100 years and not the last 20.

  • 154 hotdog // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:02 PM

    Ibiza – Get ya jacket we need to go and sort Ruddy out!

  • 155 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:03 PM

    ruddy

    i second that on keegan. the only reason i’m not screaming (or putting in caps rather) ‘pardew out’ is because of my fear of who might come next

    and on last night, i couldn’t say we particularly performed well, not at all.

    was it an improvement from southampton? well, come on, i don’t think we’ll see many worse displays than that

    was there heart? plenty. fight? yes. refreshing? no doubt.

    but we had 10 outfield players with the same lack of cohesion. dunno where jonas was playing (if you didn’t catch the match he was abysmal again. 110% effort but i could give 110% too.).

    we were definitely not in a 442, but we by no means were in a 433 or 4312 or 4231 or whatever anyone else wants to say. we were pretty aimless.

    def take the effort as a major positive. hard-pressed to say it was a ‘good’ performance though. first half was dire by both sides but stoke definitely had more attacking intent. second half we capitalized on a defensive mishap, which was nice to see, but to me at least the win never looked deserved and Pulis made the perfect substitutions. Pardew did not.

  • 156 Ketsbaia9 // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:03 PM

    Team for Mon:

    Krul

    Santon Perch/Good Coloccini Anita

    Tiote

    Obertan Abeid Marveaux

    Cisse Ba

  • 157 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:05 PM

    jimily

    good point. seattle sounders in the MLS get gates of 60,000 + every home match

  • 158 Ruddy Marveaux-lous // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:06 PM

    Jimiley

    The last 20 are more relevant when determining the future of the club. Man United were relegated in the 70s and then had a turbulent few years with Fergie before asserting themselves in the 90s/00s, I would hardly think anyone would call Man U a yoyo club, so why should that title apply to us?

    Our recent history defines where we are as a club in this present moment, 1 relegation in the last 20 years indicates to me that we’re in ok shape.

  • 159 Ruddy Marveaux-lous // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:09 PM

    Matty

    His hands are tied with injuries, we have no game changers to bring in, unless we’re counting Nile “GangstaBoi” Ranger.

    Kightly and Jerome, while not prolific, are better options than we have available at the moment, but I didn’t see the game and can’t comment too much about it.

    I’m not panicking, just disappointed by how the season has panned out. Although many teams have dreadful starts to the season and go on a second half surge a la Everton and Wigan, who is to say that we won’t do the same :D

  • 160 jimiley // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:09 PM

    Matty
    And they watch rubbish. Some of their players might struggle to get in the Hartlepool team.
    Ruddy,
    Fair points you make. But this club has been going backwards since 1996. Ups and downs but gradually backwards.

  • 161 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:10 PM

    off topic, but shame HBA didn’t make it onto the Puskas award shortlist

    def think he deserved to be there with Neymar and Stoch, but of course i’m obscenely biased

  • 162 Indian Magpie // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:10 PM

    Salt lake stadium in Kolkata, India has a capacity of 1,20,000 and the Kolkata derby is a sell out.

  • 163 toonarmydownsouth // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:12 PM

    Tequila
    Obviously defence is a problem aye and all 3 of our CB’s have been pretty suspect, feel willo’s taking most the slack but in all honesty colo’s been exposed a fair few times this season and theres no difference between tayls and willo for me this season tbh both need replacing/upgrading
    But also think the hoof ball stems from how p1ss poor tiote’s been there have been a few games this season where there have been genuine attempts to play it out from the back and tiotes either passed to no one, diagonal ball to know one, danced around in a circle and played his way into trouble got dispossed and we’ve been caught out or he’s been caught out been dispossed scythed someone down and we’ve had to defend a set piece which we are truly poor at! Half the time were relying on ba to clear a corner then expect him to be up the other end for the corner!!!

  • 164 jimiley // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:13 PM

    Indian Magpie,
    My point exactly. Many Geordies claim that the Toon is a big club but cannot justify it. The club is big in the North East but is not on the radar of most other big clubs worldwide who wins things.

  • 165 Ruddy Marveaux-lous // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:14 PM

    Jimiley

    Well I have very strong feelings on Keegan, and don’t look on the era as fondly as others do, but I respect that we were in our loftiest position in 1996 and that anything other than that position could be seen as going backwards. But in an era of unprecedented wealth and expenditure that was ushered in by Chelsea how could we compete to that level?

    SBR’s era was a brilliant time for the club, I would even argue that I feel more fondly about this time than the Entertainers (but many wouldn’t share those sentiments). I would say that we’ve been in steady decline since around 2005/06 but that Pardew’s era ushers in a period of growth, but we may have to experience some rough patches to see the benefits in the long term.

    This is all speculation however, I could be totally wrong but I always look on the bright side of life, especially where our club is concerned :D

  • 166 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:15 PM

    jimily

    they have a small pacy striker i’d take in a heartbeat; freddy montero.exactly the type of striker we need. good finisher, quicker than shane long, and very, very smart with his movement

    quite a few players in MLS i’d be more than welcome with here. Mike Williamson (I’m not exaggerating) would be about on par with most defenders in that league.

  • 167 Ketsbaia9 // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:17 PM

    Williamson is worse than the majority of Sunday morning pub league players. Tamas Kadar was a lot better than Mike and he used to get forward and have a dig.

  • 168 tequilamag // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:20 PM

    Kets can you do that one you do about Simmo as well. I love the old favourites.

  • 169 Ruddy Marveaux-lous // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:20 PM

    Ah Kets…words elude me.

  • 170 mattyNUFC // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:22 PM

    agree with kets there. I always rated Kadar.

  • 171 hotdog // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:22 PM

    Ruddy – If you cant look fondly on the Keegan Years then seriously mate you have got big big problems. What is wrong with you? In fact dont answer that we could be here a while!

    Im off to watch the Keegan Years DVD “Just love it”

  • 172 Ibizatoon - Back by popular demand // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:23 PM

    Hotodg…I came as quick as I could, my apologies. I was actually enjoying one of your relatives for lunch….how can I help? :)

  • 173 BelfastMagpie // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:25 PM

    This season has been a disaster so far.

    The only good thing is we’ve managed to get 14 points on the board.

    We should really be sitting on less points,only we got lucky in a few games.

  • 174 Ruddy Marveaux-lous // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:26 PM

    Hotdog

    Don’t really want to go into it, The Entertainers were great and the football was superb but Keegan puts a dampener on what should have been the best era of NUFC history. As far as I am concerned, he is to blame for that.

    Haven’t got big problems, just got a different opinion. That is allowed isn’t it? :P

  • 175 Ibizatoon - Back by popular demand // Nov 29, 2012 at 4:28 PM

    Belfast….But what about all the times we’ve shared? Are they not highlights of this season? You really can be an insensitive pr*ck! ;)




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